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Topic: Saudi Arabia and obedience to the Rulers
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 abdulilah
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Member
Posts: 327
Joined: Sep 2002
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Saudi Arabia and obedience to the Rulers
First of all, even if a ruler takes a land by force and he rules that land then he is to be obeyed in that which is obedience to the Allaah and His Messenger sallallaahu 'alaihi wa sallam. The ahadeeth are many proving this in Saheeh Muslim kitaab al Imaara. In Imam Nawawee's sharh see v.12 p.426 dar al Ma'rifah print.
You will find a chapter heading, "The obligation of obeying the rulers/in that which is not sin and its prohibition if it leads to sin."
Allaah said "O you who believe, Obey Allaah and His Messenger and those in authority over you"[Nisaa:59]
The commentators of this verse have clearly said, "Those in authority over you" are the scholars and leaders. But their obedience is conditional that it does not lead to disobedience.{See Ibn Katheer}
Further in Saheeh Muslim Muslim you will come to the hadeeth of Hudayfah ibn al Yaman (no.4761) where the Prophet sallallaahu 'alaihi wa sallam clearly said to Hudayfah "Upon you is to stick to the jamaa'ah of the Muslims and their Imam" One of the scholars of Madinah, Sheikh Faalih ibn Nafi' al Harbi hafidhahu llaah says in a lecture entitled 'Tamayu' (leniency which is not in its place), he said that there is no Jama'aah except that there is hearing and obeying and there is no hearing and obeying except to the leaders.
So, if you live under a Muslim ruler like in Saudi Arabia, then there must be obedience to him in the ma'roof (good) not in the disobedience to Allaah. Going out against the Muslim ruler whether you are from that country or outside it then this is from the way of the Khawaarij.
That is why as Sheikh Muhammad Abdulwahhab al Banna says "When the Khawarij went astray the Muslim called themselves Ahlu Sunnah wal Jamaa'ah while initially they were Ahlu Sunnah and the word 'Jamaa'ah' was added since the Sahaba stuck to the Jamaa'ah while the khawaarij did not."
Rather they went out against Ali Radiallaahu 'anhu until they killed him. And they, the Khawaarij, killed Uthmaan radiallaahu 'anhu while he was reciting the Quran in his own home. What good have they brought to this Ummah, they kill the people of Islaam and leave the idol worshippers. they spill the blood of Muslims and ask about the blood of a mosquito. The companions considered their own worship deficient compared to the Khawaarij for they were extreme in their worship but they were called the dogs of the hellfire by the Messenger sallallaahu 'alaihi wa sallam. For they made the blood of the Muslims lawful and went out against the Muslim rulers.
The ruler in Saudi Arabia is as Sheikh Muhammad Abdul wahhab al Banna states "the best Muslim ruler in the world because he aids Islaam in its spreading across the world, in Muslim schools in allowing the callers to call to Tawheed and in establishing Islaam. And you will find that the rulers here are even better than the people. Do they want the ruler here to fall and then have the Shee'ah ruling the country!!! Walaahi, walaahi, thoma walaaahi, you either be grateful and thank Allaah what he has given you or Allaah will change your situation and the Ikhwaanil muslimeen will cause corruption in this country just as they did in Syria, Egypt and now in Algeria."
This sheikh is 90 years old and has lived in Saudi here longer than any political activist who doesn't know the affairs of the country. And he has lived through the head of the century both the hijri and the gregorian calenders while the head of Ikhwaanil muslimeen Hasan al Banna (and they are not related) did not live at the head of any of these centuries and we all know the hadeeth about the scholars reviving the deen at the head of the century.
I heard Sheikh Obayd al Jaabree and sheikh Fawzaan and other mashayakh all say that we are not saying that Saudi is complete but we say that they are ruling by Islaam.
In Sharhus Sunnah of Barbaharee, you will see that the sign of ahlu sunnah is that they supplicate for the rulers' betterment while the sign of ahlu bida'ah is that they curse the rulers.
In Usoolus Sunnah of Imam Ahmed you will see how Imam Ahmed spent special care and attention to call the people to hear and obey their rulers and not to go out against them and this is even after he was tortured for saying the Quran is the Speech of Allaah.
In Musnad of Imam Ahmed there is an authentic hadeeth, "whoever wants to advise the ruler then not to do it openly but secretly taking him by the hand"
Is going out against the rulers or even speaking in public against them following the Messenger sallallaahu 'alaihi wa sallam????
Sheikh 'Obayd al Jabree hafidhahullaah states that fi one says they are not able to go to the ruler and advise him face to face then we say to them as Allaah says "on no soul does Allaah place a burden more than they can bear." soorah al Baqara:286
Rather, as Sheikh Muhammad Abdulwahhab al Banna said "The ikhwaanil Muslimeen want to fool the people like a scorpian fooled the frog. The scorpian says let me climb on your back to get across the water and i won't harm you as i will also drown. So as soon as they get close to the other side it strikes its poison and kills the frog."
The Hizbutahreer and other political activist claim that the last khilaafah fell in 1927 but what kind of khilaafah was it??? was there Tawheed implemented as in Saudi?? was the Sunnah been pushed out or much innovations and shirk?? but these political activist don't value Tawheed, in Saudi, there are no graves even above the ground so they are not worshipped. Even in the masjid Nabawee, the grave of the Prophet sallallahu 'alaihi wa sallam that is on the side of the masjid has no extension to the left of it so that the grave is not taken as part of the Masjid.
If you go to Uhud much da'wah is against grave worshipping by supplication to the dead for intercession or others forms.
In the government school curriculum in Saudi Arabia, all students must go through Usool Thalatha, Kashfu Shubuhaat, Kitaabu Tahheed, books which uphold Tawheed and negate Shirk.
As sheikh Muqbil rahimahullaah said in the tape mentioned earlier that he would go out at night to the Haram from his hotel due to not being able to sleep and would not fear anything, complete 'aman' security and then he recited soorah al Quraysh. And he said that one of the reasons for this security and peace in Saudi Arabia was because they uphold the laws of Allaah, the hadd punishments etc.
Look at the alternative, those political activist reside in kuffar countries for protection under a KAAFIR government. Are not those rulers there clearly kuffar? so are they going out against those kuffar governments??
There is no Might and Power except that Might and Power belonging to Allaah.
By Allaah, being with the Muslims here in Saudi Arabia, with the scholars of Tawheed and in the land of Tawheed is more dearer to us and our children than to be a political activist in the land of the kuffar where your prayer is deficient, your fasting is difficient, your Zakah is deficient.
The order from Allaah to rule by Allaah's law is addressed to all of us not just the rulers so take a look at these political activists and their own lives they lead and see how the heads of them are tawagheet for they add to the legislation of Allah that which was not there. They have twisted the meanings of verses and ahadeeth rather than go back to the Quran and Sunnah in the understanding of our pious predecessors.
Allaah knows best.
التراجع إلى الحق فضيلة
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| ibn.khalid
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Member
Posts: 33
Joined: Sep 2002
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Assalamu Aliakum,
Shukran Abdulilah for your post. Can you please clarify what you meant by the following statement:
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...to be a political activist in the land of the kuffar where your prayer is deficient, your fasting is difficient, your Zakah is deficient.
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Were you specifically referring to the political activist's prayers, fasting and Zakah being deficient or did you mean that generally a Muslim's prayers, fasting and Zakah are deficient if he/she lives in the lands of the Kuffar? If you meant the latter, please explain how and why these acts of worship are deficient.
Jazak Allahu Khair
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| abdulilah
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Member
Posts: 327
Joined: Sep 2002
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jazakallaahu khaairan akhee,
I remember hearing this or reading it from one of the scholars inshaallaah i will confirm it.
I remember the explanation given for the establishment of fasting being defficient or naaqis due to the fact that the order for the beginning and end of Ramadan and eeds in Saudi is given by the wali amr once a truthful man has sighted it. Also the Zakaat is collected by the wali amr and distributed to the needy. These do not happen in a kaafir country rather each group of Muslim do their own thing not being collective under one Muslim ruler so it is defficient.
As for the prayer, then you know the adhaan is not heard outside masaajid and this is from the defficiency of its establishment.
Jazakallaahu khairan i should have explained it properly. And it does not refer only to the political activists but to all Muslims in the land of the non Muslims but i was mainly addressing the question regarding the political activist causing doubts to the questioner above.
I will see if i can find it or at least take it to the scholars if i can't find it.
التراجع إلى الحق فضيلة
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| AbooTasneem
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Member
Posts: 265
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Baarakallaahu feekum Yaa akhal Kareem! Would you please make this statement: "As for the prayer, then you know the adhaan is not heard outside masaajid and this is from the defficiency of its establishment"...
a little bit more clearer, because there a quite a few places in the USA (our masjid being one of them) where the Mu'adhdhin is SEEN (by the common people) and the Aadhaan is heard five times per day OUTSIDE of the masjid, everyday! In fact, some of the kuffaar in the area regulate their affairs on our Aadhaan!
كن مستفيدا أو مفيدا
أو اسكت بحلم
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| alykhan.somani
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Member
Posts: 67
Joined: Dec 2002
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...
This message was edited by alykhan.somani on 7-13-05 @ 4:06 AM
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| AbooTasneem
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Member
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Joined: Sep 2002
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This is very common on the East Coast of the USA whether it be North or South. Very common!
كن مستفيدا أو مفيدا
أو اسكت بحلم
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| abu.talhah.a
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Member
Posts: 136
Joined: Nov 2002
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This (the Adhaan called outside the Masjid in the open, without a mic) is also done at Masjid al-Mu'min in Los Angeles, California. Probable the only place done in Southern California.
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| abdulilah
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Member
Posts: 327
Joined: Sep 2002
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All praise is due to Allaah, i testify to His Oneness and that Muhammad sallallaahu 'alaihi wa sallam is His slave and Messenger.
I managed to find the reference for the matter above. I read it is a book called "Al Faslul Mubeen fi mas'alatil Hijrah wa Mufaaraqatil Mushrikeen" written by a student of knowledge Husayn ibn 'Awdah al 'Awaishah.
See p. 98 to 105
On p. 103 he summarises those that live under the Mushrikeen by saying, "It has become clear the defficiency in their prayer, fasting, zakaat and Jihaad and their shortcoming in raising the kalimah of Allaah and the witness of Truth..."
I called this evening (21 Dhul Qa'dah 1423h - 24/1/03)Sheikh Muhammad Abdulwahhab al Banna hafidhahullaah and mentioned this to him and read the Kallam of Husayn al 'Awaishah and this is what our beloved sheikh said:
"I see that their residing (there) will help Islam, the residing of those who became Muslim and have known the truth will benefit, i see that they will be rewarded because if all the salafees leave who is going to stay there? In reality, many of the companions and the tabi'een went to the disbelieving lands and many lands were opened, the land of Ceen (China) and also India was opened by da'wah. In my opinion the salafees who are firm upon Salafiyyah will be a very good example in their country and many people will come to Islaam due to them. So there staying there is better, that is if a person is able to keep the affairs of his religion upright as it should be...(unclear)."
Then i asked the sheikh concerning using the word naaqis regarding their prayer, Zakaat, and fasting and the sheikh replied:
"If they have no Jamaa'ah and no Imam and Allaah knows what is going to happen and Allaah predestined for the companions to ask and for the Messenger to reply from revelation that was revealed to him sallallaahu 'alaihi wa sallam. Allaah knows that the Muslims will disperse into many lands so he sallallaahu 'alaihi wa sallam mentioned the hadeeth of Hudayfah that you stick to the jamaa'ah of the Muslims and their Imam, if their is no imam then they should stick to the Jama'aah... they don't allow the adhaan and duroos to be outside of the masjid. The Messenger sallallaahu 'alaihi wa sallam in Makkah was not able to give the adhaan...(unclear) look, ask Sheikh Rabee' ibn Haadi since he has more experience than me as for me i believe your presence there will bring much good especially if you can protect the well-being of your children and youths amongst you. "
Then the sheikh said regarding Saudi:"Whatever it has it is the best country to be in the world"
It is good to hear from the sheikh's wisdom that if one is able to guard himself and his children and the youths and they are strong in their salafiyyah then their presence will benefit.
The words from our brother Abu Tasneem hafidhahullaah are also encouraging that they are able to give the adhaan outside in public in parts of America.
I must say that i have heard Sheikh Rabee' hafidhahullaah be very strong against living in the land of the kuffar except for those who are not able because of the humiliation of living under the disbelievers. I have heard Sheikh Fawzan hafidhahullaah speak very strongly against living in the lands of the disbelievers. Also sheikh al Albaani rahimahullaah used to encourage hijrah to protect your deen and your children's.
From all this, and Allaah knows best, there seems to be a lot of detail regarding each and everyone's specifc situation but all the scholars agree that you must be able to guard and protect your deen and families deen. And one must be sincere to Allaah regarding this. I ended the conversation with sheikh al Banna by saying:
كل مقام مقال
every situation has a saying and the sheikh agreed.
التراجع إلى الحق فضيلة
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| abu.naimah.shamsuddi
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Member
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Joined: Dec 2002
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Al-Hamdulillahi Ta'Ala wa salatu wa salamu ala Rasulullah, wa ala Alihi was Sahbihi wa salam
Amma ba'du;
Salamu alaikum wa rahmatullah;
QUESTION:
In the event that an Imam of a masjid says something of misguidance publicly in front of a group of Muslims [i.e. 50 or so], such as "Suhur is not of the Sunnah" or "the Throne of Allah shakes at Talaq", or "we have now come from the minor Jihad to the major Jihad [i.e. against one's lower nafs]." These statements not being made in a khutbah, but rather a gathering.
Is it deemed proper to correct them on the spot so that the Muslims do not leave that gathering with misguided information?
Abu Na'imah Shamsuddin
This message was edited by abu.naimah.shamsuddi on 1-25-03 @ 12:30 AM
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| ibn.khalid
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Member
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Baarak Allaahu Feek Akhee Abdulilah
Thank you for the explanation and reference that you provided regarding the statement I was enquiring about.
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| abu.naimah.shamsuddi
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Member
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Joined: Dec 2002
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Al-Hamdulillah wa salatu wa salamu ala Rasulullah
Salamu alaikum wa rahmatullah;
Jazakallahu khairun for the information and relating the example of the knowledgable Imam, Shaikh Nasiruddeen Al-Albani [rahimahullah Ta'Ala]. He had the respect of many and the opposition of the ignorant. This seems to be the pattern laid out for those whom Allah, Azza wa Jall, has endowed with something of knowledge and/or information to pass on.
Allah reward you brother, this serves as a reminder too, of the opposition
before those who give this Dawah. "SPEAKING THE TRUTH IN THE FACE OF OPPOSITION"
Abu Na'imah Shamsuddin
This message was edited by abu.naimah.shamsuddi on 1-26-03 @ 12:50 PM
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| Moosaa
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Member
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Joined: Sep 2002
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and correcting a wrong must be done upon knowledge, for if you were to refute him without knowledge, you may cause more harm than good. imagine this:
khateeb: "...and the prophet sallallaahu 'alayhe wa sallam said that the Throne of Allaah shakes due to divorce..."
attendee: (after khutbah and salaah) "Bismillaah, alhamdulillaah, I need to inform you all that the hadeeth the khateeb used is not authentic..."
khateeb: "yes it is"
attendee: "no its not"
khateeb: "yes it is"
attendee: "no its not" etc.
and whoever waits for the people to leave so they can correct the salafee imaam who is known for his humility and love of correctness, then he has a salaf from the story of Imaam Maalik and his student Ibn Wahb:
Imaam Maalik was asked about wiping between the toes in wudhoo'. He said, "That is not from the Sunnah." So I waited until most of the people had left, and said, "We have a hadeeth about that." Imaam Maalik asked for it and Ibn Wahb narrated it. Imaam Maalik identified its authenticity and then used to order the people to wipe between their toes in wudhoo'. See the introduction to The Prophet's Prayer Described (sallallaahu 'alayhe wa sallam).
This may be done in hopes that if the salafee imaam who the people trust will correct his own self, more people will accept it and there is no chance for any fitnah, like people understanding you are insulting the imaam, or makng fitnah, etc.
And Allaah knows best.
Moosaa
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سبحانك اللهم وبحمدك
أشهد أن لا إله إلا أنت
أستغفرك وأتوب إليك
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| abu.naimah.shamsuddi
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Member
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Joined: Dec 2002
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wa alaikum salam wa rahmatullah;
Jazakallahu khairun unto both of you for your most informative replies.
Abu Na'imah Shamsudden
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| abdulilah
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Member
Posts: 327
Joined: Sep 2002
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I went to see Sheikh Muqbil rahimahullaah before he past away. He was in hospital in Jeddah and he said to me since i was from Morocco: "Tell Maghraawi that i am an advisor to him and to take back his error and he promised to do so, and i told him to do it in writing and to give me a copy and a copy to sheikh Rabee'. Tell him i am an advisor to him and it is from the blessing of Allaah that Allaah gives you strong students of knowledge who correct you. And how many times in Dammaj i will be corrected on the spot and i would take it back there and then. This is from the blessing of Allaah." Obviously i was not able to tell Maghraawi but this is for the record.
But later Maghrawee denied that he was to make any Tawbah or retraction of his errors. He decides to go against the truth and people of truth. About 15 scholars refuted him for his errors which until now did not take back.
So too Adnan Urur, Ahmed Sallam also refuted by the scholars and so too Abul Hasan also refuted by about 21 scholars.
We ask Allaah for Thabat and Ikhlaas.
التراجع إلى الحق فضيلة
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21-01-2003 @ 12:00 AM
22-01-2003 @ 12:00 AM
26-01-2003 @ 12:00 AM
27-01-2003 @ 12:00 AM