Topic: Need clarification regarding Riba/quote from Hadhrat Umar

sajid_chauhan_81    -- 01-05-2008 @ 11:16 PM
  Abdullaah Yusuf Ali mentions in his footnotes regarding riba, "Hadhrat 'Umar, according to Ibn Kathir, felt some difficulty in the matter, as the Apostle left this world before the details of the question were settled.  This was one of the three questions on which he wished he had more light from the Prophet."

Many modernists use this to legitimize bank interests on savings account. Is this quote from Hadhrat Umar radiAllaahu anhu authentic?

JazakAllaahu khayran.

sajid_chauhan_81    -- 08-29-2009 @ 5:07 PM
  The following is taken from Tafsir of Imam ibn Kathir rahimahullah for the verse Surah Baqarah:275.

The subject of Riba is a difficult subject for many scholars. We should mention that the Leader of the Faithful, `Umar bin Al-Khattab, said, "I wished that the Messenger of Allah had made three matters clearer for us, so that we could refer to his decision: the grandfather (regarding inheriting from his grandchildren), the Kalalah (those who leave neither descendants nor ascendants as heirs) and some types of Riba.' `Umar was refering to the types of transactions where it is not clear whether they involve Riba or not. The Shari`ah supports the rule that for any matter that is unlawful, then the means to it are also unlafwful, because whatever results in the unlawful is unlawful, in the same way that whenever an obligation will not be complete except with something, then that something is itself an obligation.

The Two Sahihs recorded that An-Nu`man bin Bashir said that he heard the Messenger of Allah say,

ıııııı ıııııııııı ııııııı ııııııı ıııııııııı ııııııı ıııııııı ıııııı ııııııı ııııııııııııı ıııııı ııııııı ıııııııııııı ııııııııııı ııııııııı ııııııııııı ıııııı ıııııı ııı ıııııııııııı ıııııı ııı ııııııııııı ııııııııııı ııııııı ııııı ıııııııı ııııııı ıııı ıııııııı ıııı

(Both lawful and unlawful things are evident, but in between them there are matters that are not clear. So whoever saves himself from these unclear matters, he saves his religion and his honor. And whoever indulges in these unclear matters, he will have fallen into the prohibitions, just like a shepherd who grazes (his animals) near a private pasture, at any moment he is liable to enter it.)

The Sunan records that Al-Hasan bin `Ali said that he heard the Messenger of Allah say,

ııııı ııı ııııııııı ııııı ııı ııı ıııııııû

(Leave that which makes you doubt for that which does not make you doubt.)

Ahmad recorded that Sa`id bin Al-Musayyib said that `Umar said, "The Ayah about Riba was one of the last Ayat to be revealed, and the Messenger of Allah died before he explained it to us. So leave that which makes you doubt for that which does not make you doubt.'

Ibn Majah recorded that Abu Hurayrah said that the Messenger of Allah said,

ııııııııı ııııııııı ıııııá ııııııııııı ıııı ıııııııı ııııııııı ıııııı

(Riba is seventy types, the least of which is equal to one having sexual intercourse with his mother.)

Continuing on the subject of prohibiting the means that lead to the unlawful, there is a Hadith that Ahmad recorded in which `A'ishah said, "When the Ayat in Surat Al-Baqarah about Riba were revealed, the Messenger of Allah went out to the Masjid and recited them and also prohibited trading in alcohol.' The Six collections recorded this Hadith, with the exception of At-Tirmidhi. The Two Sahihs recorded that the Messenger of Allah said,

ııııııı ııııı ıııııııııı ııııııııı ıııııııııı ıııııııııı ıııııııııııı ııııııııııá ıııııııııı ıııııııııııû

(May Allah curse the Jews! Allah forbade them to eat animal fat, but they melted it and sold it, eating its price.)

`Ali and Ibn Mas`ud narrated that the Messenger of Allah said,

ııııııı ııııı ııııı ıııııııı ııııııııııı ııııııııııııı ıııııııııı

(May Allah curse whoever consumes Riba, whoever pays Riba, the two who are witnesses to it, and the scribe who records it.)

They say they only have witnesses and a scribe to write the Riba contract when they want it to appear to be a legitimate agreement, but it is still invalid because the ruling is applied to the agreement itself, not the form that it appears in. Verily, deeds are judged by their intentions.

Hamza.I.A    -- 08-30-2009 @ 3:39 PM
  Maybe you should include the ayahs in which he writes these footnotes for.  It would make the search easier.

Abu Khuzaimah Hamza Bin Ahmad
Toronto, Canada

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